OSA & diabetes

[Barely Awake]

I have been diagnosed diabetic but prior to and suspecting this I started testing myself and noticed that those days I particularly had mask or some other sleep problems my blood sugar was higher first thing (approx double what it was supposed to be) and stayed higher than most other days despite attempting to be good with diet. A good night saw it sink to borderline rather than confirmed diabetic.

Anyone with experience of OSA and diabates noticed anything like this?

[Berneta]

YES

Hi Barely Awake, I too am a Diabetic (under control almost all the time) but I have noticed that a good night will produce a lower blood sugar reading in the morning. (About 120) If I have had a restless night, it is always higher (About 140). Don't know why that is so--but I do know that stress will make blood sugar go higher and I assume that a restless night casuses stress, During a good night's sleep the liver releases just the right amount of glucose we need, to keep things on an even keel. So it probably has something to do with stress and the liver function. I always wake at 3:30 or 4 AM and need to eat or drink something because my sugar has dropped too low. So down goes a little juice or a couple glucose tablets and I go right back to sleep. I have to add--that some of us just sleep lighter than others do--I hear every sound indoors or out, so that has an effect on me, Try some music or a Fan or something to drown out noise. That might help. Don't eat to much or drink a lot in the evening or your sugar may be higher in the morning-- and that can cause digestive problems too. You may be restless too if you feel a mild urge to go to the loo. Watch your sugar intake and your heavy carb intake in the daytime--to try to get yourself on a good level before going to bed. Of course that may not apply if you take insulin. My Dr told me not to go to sleep with a blood sugar lower than 140. And even then mine always drops in the early morning hours. No one answer for everyone. Hope this helps. X Berneta

[jackyk]

im waiting results of a blood test to confirm if i have diabetes. a fast test gave a higher than average reading so they did an averaging test and am waiting results tomorrow for that. i know osa and diabetes go hand in hand but have also got a family history of both type1 and type2 diabetes.
hopefully im not but if i am well i can live with it

[Berneta]

Diabetes

Hi Jacky, hope that you don't have it--we do have highs now and then, without having Diabetes. Not everyone who has OSA has Diabetes and vice versa. But if you do have it--its just another thing to deal with-- and the medical profession has made a lot of improvements over the years. I use an insulin pen that has needles so small, you can't even feel them. But if you do have it--I hope it can be controled with diet, exercise, and medications (pills). Like you--both types of it run in my family. Half my family doesn't have it at all--genetics are random. Today--even children can give themselves blood tests and shots easily. The needles are so thin and small you can barely see them. Good luck on your test. x Berneta

[jackyk]

being tested for type2, so will only be either diet-controlled or tablets at worse.
my 18year old neice has just been sorted with an insulin pump, its amazing peice of equipment, saves the 4 times daily injections she used to need.
have been diagnosed as pre-diabetic for the last 3 years now, so fingers crossed. have bloods done every 6 months to check, but this is first time ive had a follow up done. will find out tomnight for certain

[Barely Awake]

I have older family that have found difficulty with tablets for diabetes as you can get caught short and need to find a loo quicker than they can make it. The pens seem amazing so I will try that if allowed and I'll give diet a similar stab (pun intended).

What you say about stress and loss of sleep pushing up readings make sense to me Berneta, thanks for sharing that.

[Barely Awake]

After several weeks of self testing and attempting a diet (diabetic diet advice is the most confusing and conflicting I have ever encountered), I have lost more than half a stone and blood sugar readings have come rapidly down and appear stable almost within the upper limits. Hopefully this will continue to improve but my first reading of the day is always the worst by far and either bordering or over the upper figure given in my book (5-7 before meals, 11 two hours after).

What I can't get my head round is managing to keep day time figures down through diet but not being able to do anything about the morning result.

[Berneta]

Dibetic Morning High

Hi, Our liver stores excess sugar (glucose) and releases it during the night. Without that function we would have a low blood sugar episode, and likely die during sleep. Try to eat less carbs and sugar in the day--and the liver won't have so much to store. Esp watch what you eat and drink in the late evenings. Do enough testing during the day to learn how much something (like a piece of toast) will raise your sugar level. When you learn how much a food will raise it--and which foods you should avoid, the morning high should go down some. But you will never have complete control over your liver. If you take diabetic pills (if not allergic)--that could help keep your suger level on a more even keel. One thing is for sure--diet and exercise won't do the whole job in some people. I don't know why--but since starting the CPAP, my morning blood sugar is lower. So getting enough oxygen at night may have something to do with it. My Dr tells me that stress raises blood sugar. So--if we don't sleep well--then we experience some stress during the night. I think Sleep Apnea affects every part of our lives. I know its hard to deal with it all at once! I average 6 about all the time--but it takes work. Last wek one of my sons had a heart attack and my Blood Sugar went ski hi--he is ok now. Good luck, and I hope you can get it down more. x Berneta

[Barely Awake]

Many thanks Berneta. There is quite a bit to get your head round including overcoming what you thought was right and discovering was wrong.

I take your tip abou toast (oh, toast, with butter, if only with marmalade and marmite...[not my invention you either love it or hate it]). Current puzzle is why blood sugar is much lower in the morning if eating 2 oatcakes prior to going to bed rather than none. Guess trial and error will take years and never stop!

Thanks again.

[Tigers Fan]

A less stressful way

All this blood sugar testing is very stressful, isn't it. I've long since given it up. We know what we are supposed to eat and what not so eat a lot of the former and a little of the latter, then rely on the blood test your GP does at review. ACB1? I can never remember - tells you your average sugar level over the past three months. As long as it is alright, I figure I'm alright.

I have a friend lives half the time in Spain. She makes marmalade from fruit picked in her garden. Having tasted the one with four fruits, dark sugar and molasses with a glug of Pusser rum sloshed in, there is no way I'm capable of totally giving up marmalade. I figure you just gotta choose your sin and make sure it is worthwhile.

Apart from the bread and the butter, what's wrong with marmite on toast? As with the marmalade, I reduce the magnitude of the sin by spreading it thickly, thus eating less bread per kilo of marmalade and marmite.

TF

[Berneta]

Testing

Hi--I sure agree that testing a lot is stressful in itsself-- esp. if you use one of the hospital type lancets. Those things are bitching bad-- and soon fingers are shredded. I use a very fine lancet which I barely feel, and it leaves no lacerations on my fingers. I am careful about hurting my fingers because I Quilt--Knit--do Crafts, and Crochet.
I don't test a lot now--but I did at first-- so I could learn what not to eat, and how much different foods would raise my blood sugar. Oddly--I can eat a half cup of Ice cream and get very little rise--but a half cup of oatmeal sends my sugar ski high. We have to take the time to learn how we react to what we eat--then its easier to follow a diet that suits us. I have a meter that will average my tests over a 3 month period of time, and it usually shows a result about the same as with the Dr's A1c test. I always average under 7. It would be lower--but now and then I eat a piece of pie, a chocolate iced doughnut, or a Chocolate Iced Brownie. I do indulge myself now and then, or I have cravings that can lead to a binge. The Marmalade sounds wonderful--but I would rather eat Blackberry Jam made from the berry bushes in my yard. Homemade is always better! Anyway--once you learn what you can and can't eat--its not needed to test constantly. I test if I don't feel quite right-- I have learned when I feel a Low or a High. I do use a very small dose of insulin because I can't take the pills-- and I do have lows in the middle of the night, or sometimes late in the afternoon. You have to learn how to control your sugar levels by testing--then you don't have to test so much. TF--I'm glad you are doing well with yours. But I bet it took you some time to get to that point. Knowing how you like to "figure" things--I bet you did a lot of testing at first. xx Berneta

[mart9012]

After several weeks of self testing and attempting a diet (diabetic diet advice is the most confusing and conflicting I have ever encountered), I have lost more than half a stone and blood sugar readings have come rapidly down and appear stable almost within the upper limits. Hopefully this will continue to improve but my first reading of the day is always the worst by far and either bordering or over the upper figure given in my book (5-7 before meals, 11 two hours after).

What I can't get my head round is managing to keep day time figures down through diet but not being able to do anything about the morning result.

It's complicated for sure. Testing is key and if you aren't using insulin it can take a while to get consistent results. Diabetes diet is all about balance and avoiding foods that contain a lot of sugary carbs and also being aware of how these carbs are released into our blood stream. I would recommend using the GI system to help your diet. Essentially it is about the speed in which certain foods release their carbs. So the worst for me is a jacket potato which hits me almost instantly. You can help this by including very slow carbs (whole meal or gloopy foods basically) to lower the overall speed that carbs are released.

The morning high might be the soygin effect (Dawn Phenonemen). If you go to sleep with low blood sugar that continues to fall in the night, the pancreas releases a hormone called glycogen to get the liver to release its store of glucagon (a sort of glucose). This is an emergency response to very low blood sugar and raises your blood sugar while you sleep. This can mean you wake up with high blood sugar! This shouldn't be an issue with diabetics not on certain meds or insulin but as was said before the liver does keep a store of "sugar". Check your last meal, maybe lighten it up carbwise or simply make it full of slow carbs.

Your 2 hour post meal figure is high and that might be simply a diet issue of too much sugar in your meals. Regular exercise can help the muscles burn a little more of that sugar so might help but make sure you use your diabetic clinic and doctors to work with you to get your bloods down. It might be that you need a little help from some meds and they can assess that from regular testing and noting the results for them.

Good luck!